Wally Wonders Why

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Which path shall we walk?

US Flag Our nation has taken one more step away from God.  We’ve been on this walk away from God and the Christian roots of our nation for several decades, so the giant step we took in the election was  not surprising.  Saddening, but not surprising.

I feel sadness that we live in a nation where so many people have devalued God so far that they are willing to elect a man who preaches false Christian doctrines, a man who sat in the pews of a hate filled church for 2 decades and a man who casually dismisses our nations Christian roots..

Whatever we once were, we’re no longer just a Christian nation; we are also a Jewish nation, a Muslim nation, a Buddhist nation, a Hindu nation, and a nation of nonbelievers. We should acknowledge this and realize that when we’re formulating policies from the state house to the Senate floor to the White House, we’ve got to work to translate our reasoning into values that are accessible to every one of our citizens, not just members of our own faith community.

Barack Obama, July 30, 2007

“Whatever we once were”  Such an odd question to come from a man who we just elected president.

No doubt we will have many challenges over the course of the next 4 years and I pray that we will meet those challenges head on and with dignity.

One of the first will be a challenge to treat Barack Obama with all the respect that we would any president of the greatest nation on earth.  I don’t want to hear anyone referring to him as not their president, just because they didn’t vote for him.  How demeaning to our nation and our people.  He will be our president come January, get used to it.

But we should also challenge our new president to rise above mere human values and conduct his administration with God given morality and ethics; the values of the Christian nation that we once were and still can be again.

If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

2 Chronicles 7:14

Our nation still has tremendous freedom of religion.  More than most places on earth, and certainly enough for Christian values to flourish, if we really truly want that.  When it comes to immorality and dare I say, persecution of Christians, America of today has nothing on ancient Rome.  Ancient Rome, where all manner of depraved behavior was glorified and Christians were put to death for sport.  Yes that ancient Rome, where in spite the unspeakable conditions Christians were subjected to, Christianity grew, and grew, and grew, through a faith so strong that mortal death and persecution could not stop it.

Coincidentally, November 9th, is the International Day of Prayer for the Persecuted Church.  As you pray for those around the world who are persecuted and martyred for their Christian faith, consider also a prayer for those take up God’s work in our own nation.  Better yet, become one of those people who take up His work in our nation.

Here is my post election message:

God bless America,
Land that I love,

Now is the time to;

Stand beside her and guide her
Thru the night with a Light from above;

10 Comments

  1. I vote my Christian values and I proudly voted for Obama/Biden as the far more Christian-walk-the-talk ticket.

  2. What on Earth is this nonsense about America being a Christian nation? Did I miss the “Just Kidding!” at the end of the Establishment Clause or something?

  3. Most Historians acknowledge that Our Constitution and our legal system has it roots in Judeo-Christian culture.
    This is substantiated in the many letters written between the founding fathers and transcripts from early executive and legislative sessions.

  4. Who gives a flying monkey if the constitution was grounded in the Bible? Of course it was. That was the organizing cultural key-stone for the Western World at the time. Keep in mind that the founding fathers also where well studied in the precedents of governance set by the Greeks. Are we going to start quoting Greek Gods too? The entitlement that we can exclude or dismiss good people of other faiths, this is not a “Christian” way to be. You witness by your behavior… by being loving. Not by force of will and exclusionary language or laws. The founding fathers where actually much more scared of Religion in government than they where encouraging of it. They went way out of their way to set up strong boundaries to keep the Church out of government, to allow all faiths equal access to our society.

    This line of blog started with some crackpot idea that voting for Obama was a move away from Christianity. War and a negligence of caring for the least of us is that the Republican party has stood for over several decades. “Trickle Down” has been a rationalization for greed. The main word in the phrase “tough love” is love, not tough. If your measure of Christianity is being against abortion, then you need to get straight with the man and do some more soul searching.

    What would Jesus do? …today he’d vote Democrat, like this good Christian / Ecumenical nation JUST DID.

  5. “the Congress shall make no laws respecting the establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…”

    The establishment clause was written to keep the federal government out of the business of religion, not to keep religion, as in religious values, out of the federal government. At the time, the clause was actually intended to ensure that the federal government would not choose one Christian sect over another as a national religion. We were never intended to be a secular nation.

  6. With all due respect, wally, that reeks of bs. Accepting, momentarily, that there is some kind of meaningful difference between religion influencing government and government influencing religion (which I do not at all accept, actually), the Supreme Court has, using Jefferson’s letter to the Danbury Baptists (link: http://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/9806/danpre.html ), ruled several times that the Establishment Clause was specifically intended to keep religion and government out of each other’s business. Phrases like “a wall of separation between Church & State” penned by Jefferson and in direct reference to the Establishment Clause does not support your assertion that America is or ever was a Christian nation.

    However, pretending, for the moment, that none of the above mattered and America actually was supposed to be a Christian nation (Which I do not for one second concede!): Well, the original intent is fine and dandy, but times change. Back then America was a bunch of stuffy Englishmen (Ignoring Indians for the moment, which seems a popular pastime among Americans) who almost universally worshipped Jehovah and considerations of other religions didn’t matter because people tended to stick to both their religion and place of birth.

    But nowadays I ride the bus with Muslims and Jews and Buddhists and knock elbows with fellow atheists and agnostics and secular humanists in class. I pass Sikhs running cellular telephone kiosks at the mall, tip my hat to Hindus on the street, and even run into the occasional pagan. Times change and we change along with them. Slavery used to be thought of as a good idea, but times change and we changed, too. Christianity isn’t the only religious affiliation that matters here in modern America.

  7. Wally, I don’t think saying “Christian nation” is helpful. the fact is, by definition, this would imply a theocracy…which is not something the founders intended. Saying our documents were based in Christian thought is valid, though.

    Understanding why Obama is a step backward toward “unchristian” culture is more than an abortion issue. Look no farther than the economy:

    He undermines sound (even Biblical) models of economic structures. Remember that Paul says that he who steals should stop and work instead “that he might have something to give to the poor.” This puts the job of charity squarely in the hands of the worker, who’s fruits HE himself is responsible to divide equitably — handing that job over to the government is unbiblical. Also, wealth comes by work and work alone. It is not static, to be divided like a piece of pie.

    To cry “greed” when government allows markets (ie corporations) to decide the value of work, is ignorant and fantastical. It’s like suspending the law of gravity. I can’t pretend that stunting the growth of business, big or small, is going to somehow create a large middle class. You can’t make a middle class without creating a lot of rich people as well. You can’t bring people out of poverty by shifting wealth. Instead, new wealth must be created with real, needed, valuable labor. For a business to attempt to make a profit by creating needed merchandise of its own volition, it has to have a profit to look forward to. For any just economic exchange to take place, “greed” must be present. Not the immoral type mind you. Rather, both parties must see something in it for themselves — it’s their responsibility and obligation to look out for their interests and by extension, the interests of their employees.

    John Locke’s ideas of individual ownership of both property and responsibility were biblical. His thoughts were directly injected into our founding documents — especially the Declaration of Independence.

    Funny D. You speak as though “greed” was a crime and not a motive. Greed is immoral only if it is synonymous with covetousness.

  8. I could see where you might think this reeks, but dig a bit further into the situation at the time of Thomas Jefferson’s letter and you will find out exactly what he meant with his words. Most people in our nation at the time were Christian, belonging to one sect or another. During our infancy, many were worried that our nation would adopt a national religion like the European nations that people were fleeing. The Danbury Baptists were no different; they worried that in a nation full of various Christian sects, some strong and some weak, one might rise as the national religion. The wall was built to protect the church from the government; not vice versa.

    And yes there is a meaningful difference between religion influencing government and government influencing religion. The meaningful difference is in how those affect each other, and they go right to Mark’s point in how I referred to this as a Christian nation. Probably not the best way to argue a point, but here is some explaining

    American’s of the past weren’t asked to check there religion at the door. Only in the latter part of this century has the wall or establishment clause been interpreted as anything other than protecting the church from the state.

    We could have been a Christian nation by dictate of the government, government influencing religion as you put it. And depending on how this was implemented it might have been a theocracy.

    But rather, we began as a Christian nation because we were a predominantly Christian people. Our Christian based values went into the formation of our nation; our religion influenced our government. People who still vote based on Christian values, keep contributing to the Christianity of our nation. As people vote on values other than Christianity, then our nation becomes something other than a Christian nation. And when we vote for laws that keep Christian values out of government, then we are voting for a secular theocracy, where lack of religion is the national religion.

    Mark I appreciate the extra thought regarding the slip towards unChristianism being more than an abortion issue. I started a few times to write about the Christianness of socialism, but never finished.

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